Article: The Remix64 Voting System

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Peacemaker
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Re: Article: The Remix64 Voting System

Post by Peacemaker » 28/01/2009 - 13:05

Mayhem wrote:
Peacemaker wrote:and the plus for slayradios voting system is: even those "antivotes" will be overwritten by "real votes" over the time. unless, an "anti-voter" has no life and is waiting and requesting for the songs to antivote.
No and yes, in respective answer to those two points. On R64, one person = one vote. On Slay, one person could vote ten times if the track is played ten times, and another person may only vote once because they were only around once to hear it. Or they may choose not to vote the other nine times. If the voting was consistent then we'd have the same tracks in the Slay Rated every month but we do not; generally only a few tracks seem to carry over from one month to another and the #1 spot recently seems to be something out of left field that no one predicted heh...
due to the fact that this may happen to all remixes, its just fair. and its also says something about the mood of listeners. maybe after you listened to a song 100 times, you just dont vote for it the next time but for another good and new one?

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Re: Article: The Remix64 Voting System

Post by LMan » 28/01/2009 - 13:30

I think it is not possible to have a fully representative voting system.

There are, for example, large differences if you compare a remix64 year's top 10 in the charts to the ROTY results from the same year. Does this make one of the systems invalid / obsolete? No. :)
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Re: Article: The Remix64 Voting System

Post by RobinsonMason » 28/01/2009 - 17:32

Speaking of which (off topic a bit but) what happened to the SLAY Radio voting percentages, etc. this morning?

Nothing, nada. And I don't see any announcement in the news there either.

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Re: Article: The Remix64 Voting System

Post by Ziphoid » 28/01/2009 - 17:34

RobinsonMason wrote:Speaking of which (off topic a bit but) what happened to the SLAY Radio voting percentages, etc. this morning?

Nothing, nada. And I don't see any announcement in the news there either.
It's getting close to the end of the month, hence the votes are hidden to get some tension before the results of the SLAY Rated show... :)
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Re: Article: The Remix64 Voting System

Post by RobinsonMason » 28/01/2009 - 19:27

Ah - I see, that's kind of neat. :D

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Re: Article: The Remix64 Voting System

Post by Mayhem » 29/01/2009 - 11:30

Yeah the scores are usually hidden a week before the show. The only thing you can see is the total number of votes a song has when it is played, to which you can then assess whether it has a chance to make the list (as there is a minimum vote requirement to make the list in the first place based on the total number of votes). To which I'm fairly confident I know the rough correlation...
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Re: Article: The Remix64 Voting System

Post by Dumper » 30/01/2009 - 1:24

It raises the moist'o'meter.

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Re: The voting system on rko

Post by Mordi » 03/07/2009 - 7:23

Would be nice if we could see *who* gave the smileys, even if they don't leave a shout. Forcing people to write why they vote what they vote would lead to a lot of useless comments, but their name could be visible anyway.
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Re: The voting system on rko

Post by LMan » 03/07/2009 - 9:07

Please heed my opinion as well-thought-out, based on long experience.

There's more to consider. It's not only arrangers who'd like to see who gave the green and red smilies, but there's also the other lair - the average listeners. We've had complaints like "I have to register just to vote? Fuck you."

The current voting system is as good in balance as it might be, IMO. Of course it's a compromise, between the ease and privacy interests of the listener, and the transparent / objective feedback interests of the artist.

Scenario: forced public votes
I stressed this argument over the past: if we publish the votes by force, you'll have a lot less people voting. You probably would get lesser bad votes on your song, but would that change the listener's mind? No. You just wouldn't know it.

You would also have artists, who simply can't take a bad criticism, having a go at the voter. This is not really what we want. Ask Kwed: he has an archive of hate mails from artists who couldn't take being rejected / receiving bad criticism from the jury.

Conclusion:
The voting system will never please everyones interests. It's not possible. Don't take it all too seriously. It's just a little overview about how well your work is received.
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Re: The voting system on rko

Post by DHS » 03/07/2009 - 16:14

LMan wrote: You would also have artists, who simply can't take a bad criticism, having a go at the voter. This is not really what we want.
You also would have artists, who simply can't stand anymore random and anonymous voters casting bad votes only to piss them off or because are too stupid to understand anything different from the flavor-of-the-month, leaving remixing for good and peace of mind.
The voting system will never please everyones interests. It's not possible. Don't take it all too seriously. It's just a little overview about how well your work is received.
Absolute truth. :)
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Re: The voting system on rko

Post by analoq » 04/07/2009 - 0:31

This thread looks familiar to me... Years ago I created a site that would get a LOT of (potentially) creative content so I had to develop a voting system to help users sort thru it all. We iterated over its behaviors several times and after many tweaks we got something that proved to be effective. Yet every now and then someone on the forums would suggest a change to the system that we'd already demonstrated to be ineffective. :slap: I went so far as to hide the "bad" votes within certain contexts to mitigate the hurt feelings!
LMan wrote:The current voting system is as good in balance as it might be
I believe it. With further approbation I would say that anonymous voting was essential for us and have no doubts it's essential here.
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Re: The voting system on rko

Post by Makke » 04/07/2009 - 11:27

LMan wrote:The current voting system is as good in balance as it might be, IMO.
I agree. I think this voting system is among the best and most fair ones I've seen in a community like this.

Considering LMan's got almost a decades experience in running the site, I think his opinion and decisions deserve to be seen as highly qualified.
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Re: Article: The Remix64 Voting System

Post by Ziphoid » 04/07/2009 - 11:44

We're also constantly moderating the votes if we find any suspicious behavior, which HAS happened. Unfortunately, there are no possibilities to find ALL these down- or upvotes that can occur. Also, most downvotings makes less impact when more people have voted for a track, hence it gets better after a while.

We've encountered all sorts of tries of manipulation but as said, we're trying to remove them as soon as we notice them. LMan has done some quite nifty tools to help us find these occurances as well.

There will ALWAYS be people who don't understand fairness properly or those who can't take criticism at all. Although, there'll also always be problems with other people who just downvotes something without giving a proper reason for it. We simply have to accept these facts as soon as there is a possibility to rate something somewhere.
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Re: The voting system on rko

Post by LMan » 05/07/2009 - 11:45

DHS wrote:
LMan wrote: You would also have artists, who simply can't take a bad criticism, having a go at the voter. This is not really what we want.
You also would have artists, who simply can't stand anymore random and anonymous voters casting bad votes only to piss them off or because are too stupid to understand anything different from the flavor-of-the-month, leaving remixing for good and peace of mind.
DHS: Yes, I know. And I'm really sad about this.
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Re: The voting system on rko

Post by dan gillgrass » 05/07/2009 - 18:37

LMan wrote:
DHS wrote:
LMan wrote: You would also have artists, who simply can't take a bad criticism, having a go at the voter. This is not really what we want.
You also would have artists, who simply can't stand anymore random and anonymous voters casting bad votes only to piss them off or because are too stupid to understand anything different from the flavor-of-the-month, leaving remixing for good and peace of mind.
DHS: Yes, I know. And I'm really sad about this.
DHS strikes a chord again (<-- see what I did there ;) ) It is true, but it shouldnt stop voters putting of truly talented artists releasing stuff... some people just dont like you... its a fact.... that will always be a fact, no matter who you are. And "flavour of the month" ? RKO is so sour these days I long for when Marcel, yourself, Makke, Lman, Markus, Mahoney, O2, GrB, Ferrara, JmS and Larsec were releasing stuff on a constant basis.... original, intact and damn fucking good :cheers: (and anyone I forgot there... they know who they are !!!)
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